This link below is an interview I did with Shawn Nevins from http://www.spiritualteachers.org/. There are some good interviews over at Shawn’s spiritual teachers site so well worth checking out.
Have to say I am not a spiritual teacher 🙂 but I am happy to try and answer questions either in the comments section of this site or via email.
I wasn’t as clear or focused as I could have been, but thats OK as it still gives people a chance to hear my Aussie accent! One of the thoughts I had after the interview was about curiosity. At one point Shawn makes an observation about curiosity. Early on in life I wasn’t particularly curious, but I think as life progressed I was molded into becoming curious about life. Always easier after the fact. http://www.spiritualteachers.org/podcast/eddie-traversa-interview/
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Thanks for the reply.
A couple of points come to mind. See I can’t get my head around people like Norquist describing awakening as an “eerie state”. Makes me wonder if different people stumble into different kinds of enlightenment. I mean not all those who find peace and tranquility seem deluded.
I agree that enlightenment does not necessarily make for a great teacher but it’s got to be a prerequisite. I mean how can anyone go around talking or writing about awakening without experiencing it first-hand. Thought admittedly, being a teacher requires a whole different set of skills in addition to the experience itself.
I also have an issue with the formulation that “we are all already awakened”. Until it is felt and seen, it makes little sense to say that we are awakened.
Just some thoughts.
Regards,
Amit
this is what i think is the big misunderstanding, any talk of an awakening experience is just that talk. It cannot possibly describe it. What is being described is the aftermath of awakening which is going to differ from person to person. If two people view a sunset, they are likely going to describe it differently. Enlightenment is even worse because it cannot be described and nothing can really be said about it. Every single word written about enlightenment cannot be right, not peace, oneness, love, bliss or an “eerie state”. I think your on track with your wondering on this point.
I don’t think it has to be a prerequisite simply because nothing can be said about enlightenment ever. I think nearly always it gets in the way more than it helps.
awakened is poor word choice on my part. But nevertheless, believe it or not enlightenment/god/universe however you want to look at it, is everywhere at all times. And that little bit of information is not particularly helpful for people.
Thanks again. Boy I have got to figure this out. Once you’ve gone far enough with this, it’s next to impossible to get the spiritual quest out of your system. Hope I find some resolution some day. 🙂
Hi Ed,
Just finished listening to the interview, and here are some of my observations (for whatever they are worth):
1. I was waiting for you to define “spiritual awakening”, especially in terms of how it affects the psyche. Didn’t find it.
2. Regarding Jed McKenna, I also loved the book, but he hardly frames enlightenment as in any way desirable. Whatever else spiritual teachings may disagree on, they so seem to suggest that enlightenment brings peace. Didn’t get that from the McKenna book. Plus, the fact that it’s all fiction – albeit eminently readable – does detract from the value of the book.
3. Personally, having read close to thirty spiritual teachers, I have found Adyashanti to be most relatable. Though I have had no spiritual experiences at all, I feel that I have developed a sense for identifying a teacher who is speaking from direct experience vis-a-vis someone who sounds second hand even if polished (case in point Deepak Chopra). Wonder what your thoughts are on Adya. There is also Australian teacher Linda Claire who I find authentic. Any thoughts?
4. I have practiced mindfulness on and off for years. Of late, I have started giving my attention to the raw physical sensations rather than to the thought processes. What I have encountered is a near constant sense of constriction around the chest and the head, and generalized fatigue. This became quite intense during a Vipassana retreat I attended last year. Any pointers ? (Bear in mind that I tend to think of myself as a spiritual seeker, though I suppose in all honesty all I want is inner peace ).
5. Last, it was a bit disorientating to hear a spiritualish talk in a thick Aussie accent. I associate that with cricket commentary ! Says a lot about how our conditioning interferes with perception I guess. 🙂
Thanks.
Amit
Hi Amit,
1. Discovering Self which is closer to a No Self than any identity. The problem here is the definition becomes a sticking point for seekers to attach to.
2. A number of people have had adverse experiences from awakening. What tends to get published and put out there is a cure of sorts – enlightenment is a panacea which cures your ills. But there are counter points to that whole enlightenment is bliss or enlightenment is peace movement. McKenna being one of them, Norquist another and so on. Wu Wei is also a made up character but some of his material is the best I have encountered in terms of awakening. Enlightenment does not necessarily make a good teacher. Think of it like this, you right now at this very precise moment are enlightened. Whether you know this or not, does not change that fact. If you were enlightened the only certainty is that you have been enlightened all along problems, difficulties etc included. Point being before enlightenment chopping wood, drinking water, after enlightenment, exactly the same.
3.Teachers are something you either connect with or not. If you learn something from Adya go for it. Same with any other teacher, its more about what helps you take the next step and then the next etc. See above for speaking from direct experiences. here is a thought on speaking from direct experiences. It would be like saying because I am not married, I cannot counsel on marriage. Some of the worst counselors I have encountered in the field of Marriage counseling were in fact married and were talking from direct experiences.
4. Hard to answer in this format, but go deeper into those sensations. For example, the constriction, sit with it, what shape does it have, color, size, what is it trying to tell you. What images come into your head when you focus on the image. Shift from mindfulness to focusing might be a good strategy to explore. I have an article on this site something about the differences between mindfulness and focusing which might be of use.
5. Yeah my accent is thick and not what people may be used to. BTW the interview wasn’t about enlightenment as such, the theme is more about the journey, hence why #1 is not addressed.
Cheers
Eddie